Training Development Officer ( TDO )

[Cui]

Hey OP, have you ever taken a course in human resources management in the time that you have spent earning your business degree?

If so, you probably have learned about the fact that when employers are looking to hire someone for a position, they have a certain number of KSAOs(Knowledge, Skills, and Other attributes) that the employers are looking for. As long as someone fits those traits, they can apply with the organization that is hiring.

The employer can set parameters as to whom they advertise the position to, and what demographic to target. However, it's not really possible to just say "we'll only take 500 applications, and select from those 500", since limiting the talent pool that way will prove to be detrimental to any organization, not just the CF. I would say that the CF targets a pretty broad demographic from all the ads that I have seen everywhere (my university gym, on buses, on the internet, etc.). In no way they are limiting their talent pool by the way that they advertise, so your claims of CF purposely limiting the number of applicants are baseless.

As for young people not considering the CF as a viable option, yes, your argument for that may have some merit to it. However, you have to realize that as we move to a more global economy, someone with certain talents are not just confined within the borders of their own country. Companies around the world are all looking for the best and the brightest, and they might not get it from within their own countries. Take for example how Mark Carney got appointed as the Governor of the Bank of England.

If someone is really the ladder climbing type, they can probably go somewhere where there are less formal rules regarding advancement and promotion than the CF. As well, advancements in the civilian world will be more recognizable, people will probably know what a partner at a law firm is. They might not always know what a brigade commander is. All I'm saying is that a lot of people join the CF as a calling, not just a job. Just like how some people become doctors or lawyers as a calling, they are not in it for the money.

That's just the way it is sometimes, a lot of people nowadays are only going into certain professions for the financial compensation that they can provide, and they operate on extrinsic motivation rather than intrinsic motivation, and it'll take more than just you posting on a thread on some website to change that.

A lot of posters brought up the point of "unlimited liabilities", that is true that today's society is more focused on "covering one's rear" than accepting full liability, up to and including their lives. I'm sure you see a lot of companies with the letters LLC or LLP as their suffix, as they stand for Limited Liability Corporation/Partnership, which means the owners of that company are not legally liable for certain things. This is a societal problem, not just with the CF, so posting here is not going to help either.

I really hope that what I have typed here was taught to you in class at some point, because if not, then I have serious doubts about the quality of your school if they grant you a business degree without knowing all of this, or the fact that you can't construct an effective argument.

Good luck with whatever it is that you want to do in life.

 

[SentryMAn]

Holy Fucking train wreck!
But yet I cannot look away...

To go onto your point about "Canadian Companies would benefit from a larger application pool or Talent pool"

I'll even use a REAL LIFE example if you will with facts included.

So formerly there was a company locally started here in a garage, it WAS called Radian6, maybe you've heard of them, maybe not, it makes little difference.  Surprisingly not started by a business graduate, they didn't even hire one for 2 years.

When they first started, you are correct they REALLY could have benefited from a great talent pool...which they did.  They could simply speak to people face to face about jobs and hire on the spot.  They hadn't posted a job ad up until they moved into larger office space. 

Fast forward a few years and now the company starts getting a bit bigger, post job ads, gets mediocre results, now is when that talent pool would really benefit them.  Again a lot of their employees just come from word of mouth, someone poaching a person from another organization, etc.  Hell even hiring friends of friends.

Fast forward to when the company is a large organization with about 300 employees, decent size for a locally built company.  They get a lot of press, they get a lot of talk in the local and national news, they get bought by one of the largest companies in North America SalesForce.

Now, they have jobs posted, guess what happens to their "talent pool" it goes from selecting the exact best person to receiving 1000 resumes per job posted.  Their HR team is 3 People, their job openings were at that time about 30.

SO can you state the problems and benefits that would come from this situation, think of it like a case study since that's likely all the real world business experience you have to date.

The problem, using Software to eliminate resumes, since NO ONE has the money, time, energy or staff to READ each resume submitted.

So, you theory is gone, if you think jobs are any easier/quicker to get in the private sector in Todays economy, Look forward to living in your parents basement until you are 30.

I once took a private poll of current Business students those students in yr2-3 of their studies and asked them what was going to happen post graduation:
The results although not scientific were overwhelming in favor of them "thinking they will make $50-75k/year" in a middle managers position right out of university.

On a side note to one of your various comments, yes any organization would benefit from have more qualified candidates apply BUT without increasing the pool they currently have.  Take this as "we want the right fish in our pool and none of the wrong fish.

As a middle manager hiring I would want to see 5 quality resumes that adequately fit the career I am look to fill, then 100 resumes with a 90% throw away rule.

The CF owes you nothing, the Public sector owes you nothing(if you think it's hard to get in the CF good luck in the public sector), the poor company that you will likely work for owes you nothing.

Lastly, with your attitude on here I suspect you would VR within the first 4 weeks of BMOQ.  Your instructors would have a field day with your ramblings.

 

[Cui]

Woah, I didn't say that "companies will benefit from a larger talent pool", I was simply addressing the fact that CF doesn't have a shortage in talent in terms of applicants like the OP has stated.

I'm sorry if I came across as rambling, or entitled, I didn't say that the CF or anyone else owes me anything.

But thanks for offering some insight into such matters.

 

[Jester_TG]

Cui - i think sentry was talking to the OP....?

 

[Kat Stevens]

Mods, I think this one has exceeded it's best before date, no?

 

[SentryMAn]

Cui, was meant to the OP, I would have quoted him, but lets face it he changed his story a few times, I just wanted to go after what I think is his "thesis" as he puts it.

I'm hoping he truly has Flew the coop

 

[Cui]

Cui, was meant to the OP, I would have quoted him, but lets face it he changed his story a few times, I just wanted to go after what I think is his "thesis" as he puts it.

I'm hoping he truly has Flew the coop

ahh, okay, sorry for the mini freak-out  :facepalm:

 

[George Wallace]

ahh, okay, sorry for the mini freak-out  :facepalm:

See what happens when the OP introduces the Dunning-Kruger Effect into a Forum.  :warstory:

 

[cupper]

Sir Dips seems to be stuck on the logical error that if one works, two must be better, and a whole bunch will do wonders. Doesn't work for medication, nutrition or the recruiting process, as has been noted so many times.

Now we can only hope that he will stop crying wolf, and finally stop coming back to reply. :nod:




Oh... Wait. It just dawned on me. This is his way of showing us that he IS qualified to be a TDO.

Why didn't I see it right away?

Good On you Sir Dips! Well played!


:sarcasm:

 

[Kat Stevens]

It's the TNT formula... if a little is good, a whole bunch is f***ing great!!

 

[JM2345]

1) Logically a larger and brighter talent pool could only be a good thing.

In isolation, and independent of budgetary constraints, this is true. If taking on additional application did not cost the Canadian Forces additional money, then the OP would be, logically, correct. It would be better to have a larger, better educated, talent pool with which to select from.

So in complete isolation, ignoring all economic factors, this one is correct.

So while, yes, a larger and brighter talent pool would absolutely benefit the Canadian Forces, that is only true if that larger, brighter, highly educated talent pool also is of the character that they are willing to tough out hardship and not shrink from difficulty or situations requiring patience and stamina.

I'm going to try not to just repeat everything that was already said in this thread, but you are wrong. Even if you ignore the monetary cost of processing applications, and even if we go so far as to ignore the time cost of processing applications, neither intelligence nor education are characteristics valued enough in the Canadian Forces to give a definitive overall benefit to them by increasing the number of "smart" people applying.

You are working with an assumption that because someone is highly intelligent or highly educated, that he would necessarily be hired before Joe Sixpack who has dreamed of being Infantry his whole life and can do 100 Push Ups has 20/20 vision, volunteers at an old folks home, was captain of his football team through high school, worked as a crew manager at McDonalds for 2 years, and was in Cadets growing up, but is only a high school graduate with a C+ average and scored upper middle of the pack on the CFAT.

On top of the assumption that they would definitely be hired before them, you are also working with an assumption that they would provide more of a benefit to the Canadian Forces overall than the Super Soldier I described above. You can't ignore that for every person the Canadian Forces DOES hire, they have to disappoint someone else and not hire them. The person they do decide to hire could VR during basic, while the person they decided not to hire could have been a 20 year person who moved on to other career choices after not getting an offer.

There is so much more, but it is just repeating what we in this thread have already said repeatedly. It just isn't a fact at all. It is a wild opinion based on no evidence at all, and having to ignore reality completely to even try to make it seem plausible, which it still isn't.

You seem to understand this, based on the rest of your post, so I don't know why you are saying that is it definitely a fact that the CF would be better off having more educated and intelligent applicants. We are just going around in circles here without any evidence. You have an opinion based on nothing, and that is all. There is nothing definitive about that.

 

[RyanHealy29]

Not constructive. Please delete.

 

[prairefire]

Two posts in 2 days............ almost a record for me. I spend a lot of time observing and thinking and not so much time talking but sometimes I just have to say something..........................

Why do people mistake education and what ever level achieved with intelligence and suitability for any specific occupation. In my life time of experience it rarely correlates.............................

Although it does not happen very often these days I once had a Corporal who had grade 9 education and was an outstanding soldier and one of the best mortarman that I every worked with could calculate firing tables in his head as fast as I could plot them. He later completed Grade 12 and after retirement completed University with honours and went on to be employed at an engineering firm. Where would he be if this posters guidelines were followed?

 

[Thinkingofenlisting]

I have a few questions about the job of Training and Development officer and I was hoping there might be some individuals on this forum that could answer a few questions for me.

1. The entry plan states that the preferred education is a masters in education with at least 3 years of experience as a training/educational consultant, is that set in stone? I know a lot of jobs have statements like this but they are not necessarily 100% accurate it's simply the perfect ideal the organization is looking for. I'm currently completing my masters degree in criminology and will be finished this fall. I lack the experience as an educational/training consultant from an objective standpoint, however my research revolves around the education system and the implementation of programs in schools. I also have an extensive history playing sports at high levels and I think that a lot of the skills from that are transferable in terms of experience. Would this be experience that could be considered?

2. Any other general information on the position would also be helpful ie. posting locations, career progression, work envrionment etc... I know some of this is on the website but if anybody has direct experience with this I would appreciate any insight you could offer.

Thanks

 

[DAA]

I have a few questions about the job of Training and Development officer and I was hoping there might be some individuals on this forum that could answer a few questions for me.

1. The entry plan states that the preferred education is a masters in education with at least 3 years of experience as a training/educational consultant, is that set in stone? I know a lot of jobs have statements like this but they are not necessarily 100% accurate it's simply the perfect ideal the organization is looking for. I'm currently completing my masters degree in criminology and will be finished this fall. I lack the experience as an educational/training consultant from an objective standpoint, however my research revolves around the education system and the implementation of programs in schools. I also have an extensive history playing sports at high levels and I think that a lot of the skills from that are transferable in terms of experience. Would this be experience that could be considered?

2. Any other general information on the position would also be helpful ie. posting locations, career progression, work envrionment etc... I know some of this is on the website but if anybody has direct experience with this I would appreciate any insight you could offer.

Thanks

Yup, that would pretty much be "cast in stone" and considered to be the "minimum" requirement.  But with a Masters in Criminology on the horizon, why don't you have a serious look at "MPO" (Military Police Officer)?

 

[Thinkingofenlisting]

Thanks for the reply.

Yeah that's what I was afraid of, it's unfortunate because I have the skill set that would allow me to be very successful at the job.

It's funny you mention that, I was actually looking at the MPO job last night. If you could spare me a few minutes I actually have a few questions about that as well. Again anyone with information would be helpful.

1. In looking at the website I concluded that MPO's deal more with the administrative end of the job while MP's are engaged in more traditional police work, I could be wrong here so correct me if I am.

2. I also noticed there is a lot of opportunity for career development with specialty training and advanced training, and a lot of those categories are extremely interesting. I'm going to assume that MPO's would have first shot at some of that training? or at least would be strongly considered for it versus MP's.

3. If anyone has some more detailed information on some of the training involving: Drug Investigator, and Counter-Human Intelligence Specialist I would appreciate it.

Thanks again for the timely reply.

 

[PuckChaser]

Why do you have to be an officer? If you want to do the nuts and bolts work of a police officer, be a NCM. Your degree will just make you a more competitive candidate, and you can apply for commissioning programs later to be a MPO.

 

[MikeL]

2. I also noticed there is a lot of opportunity for career development with specialty training and advanced training, and a lot of those categories are extremely interesting. I'm going to assume that MPO's would have first shot at some of that training? or at least would be strongly considered for it versus MP's.

You shouldn't assume that just because someone is a Officer they would get priority for specialty courses over a NCM.  If a NCM would benefit more from that course, they would get priority over a Officer and vice versa.

 

[Thinkingofenlisting]

forgive my ignorance skeletor, that's why I was asking the question, thanks for the information.

to Puckchaser, I get the idea of becoming an MP to be able to experience the nuts and bolts of police work, but I don't necessarily have to do that. I've invested a lot of time and energy into my education, so I would like to let it work for me where it can. Becoming an officer puts me in a higher pay grade and that's a pretty nice benefit, as well as reward for the work I've already put in.

Thanks again for the input, I appreciate it.

 

[Humphrey Bogart]

Why do you have to be an officer? If you want to do the nuts and bolts work of a police officer, be a NCM. Your degree will just make you a more competitive candidate, and you can apply for commissioning programs later to be a MPO.

This!  Officers are by nature generalists and if you really desire to get your hands dirty go NCM.