S-92/CF purchase?
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aesop081
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It is the civillian version of the aircraft that is replacing the CH-124.
Whats your point ?
Whats your point ?
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Lets lock this topic until all the facts are known from what happened to Cougar 491.
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It is really too early to tell. The TSB has a long investigation in front of them to determine of the cause was pilot error, maintenance error, design flaw, act of God, all of the above, none of the above, some of the above.
Helicopters crash. It is the way things are.
On the news they are saying the initial problem was mounting bolts/brackets, and everything cascaded from there...
Change ordered to Sikorsky choppers after N.L. crash
Updated Fri. Mar. 20 2009 9:17 PM ET CTV.ca News Staff
Article Link
Aviation investigators said Friday that a gearbox known to be deficient led to a deadly helicopter crash off the coast of Newfoundland last week.
The discovery of a busted mounting stud on the gearbox has also led officials in Canada to ground Sikorsky S-92A choppers until the problem is fixed.
On Friday, the Transportation Safety Board issued an emergency order stating that the chopper's titanium mounting studs must be replaced with steel studs.
The Federal Aviation Administration in the U.S. is currently reviewing the findings, but has yet to formally ground the helicopters.
On Jan. 28, Sikorsky Aircraft Corp. sent out a service message telling customers to replace the titanium studs within the next year or 1,250 flight hours.
Six weeks later, 17 people were killed when Cougar Flight 491 crashed nose first into frigid waters off the coast of Newfoundland.
More on link
Change ordered to Sikorsky choppers after N.L. crash
Updated Fri. Mar. 20 2009 9:17 PM ET CTV.ca News Staff
Article Link
Aviation investigators said Friday that a gearbox known to be deficient led to a deadly helicopter crash off the coast of Newfoundland last week.
The discovery of a busted mounting stud on the gearbox has also led officials in Canada to ground Sikorsky S-92A choppers until the problem is fixed.
On Friday, the Transportation Safety Board issued an emergency order stating that the chopper's titanium mounting studs must be replaced with steel studs.
The Federal Aviation Administration in the U.S. is currently reviewing the findings, but has yet to formally ground the helicopters.
On Jan. 28, Sikorsky Aircraft Corp. sent out a service message telling customers to replace the titanium studs within the next year or 1,250 flight hours.
Six weeks later, 17 people were killed when Cougar Flight 491 crashed nose first into frigid waters off the coast of Newfoundland.
More on link
http://www.pprune.org/rotorheads/163206-sikorsky-s-92-design-operations-67.html The S-92 MGB has a history of oil problems and there seems to be some controversy about what Sikorsky is or is not saying about the MGB. The issue has been ongoing for some time.
Certainly is interesting reading for anyone who appreciates the high that a good pucker factor produces.
Certainly is interesting reading for anyone who appreciates the high that a good pucker factor produces.
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CHI491 Track Log
Interesting is the flight track log taken from ATC/IFR tracking measures. Interesting to see the flight profile at 8:15EDT turn into a rapid (1500FPM) descent, then level out at 800' and ~130 kts, seven minutes later, fly for a further three minutes then descend through 300' before disappearing off scope.
Looks like what most helo guys would do with potential transmission problem, descend to a reasonably safe (lower) altitude to be in a decent position to conduct an auto if something were to worsen. Sadly something did, but not in a manner that allowed the pilots to recover safely.
G2G
Interesting is the flight track log taken from ATC/IFR tracking measures. Interesting to see the flight profile at 8:15EDT turn into a rapid (1500FPM) descent, then level out at 800' and ~130 kts, seven minutes later, fly for a further three minutes then descend through 300' before disappearing off scope.
Looks like what most helo guys would do with potential transmission problem, descend to a reasonably safe (lower) altitude to be in a decent position to conduct an auto if something were to worsen. Sadly something did, but not in a manner that allowed the pilots to recover safely.
G2G
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Back to my initial question:
If the CF is purchasing the military version of this helicopter (which is what, I think, was eluded to earlier), how will this newest FAA decision affect the procurement?
Further, as we all know, politics had a had to play in the initial tender process, will recent events have an impact?
SFB said:
If the CF is purchasing the military version of this helicopter (which is what, I think, was eluded to earlier), how will this newest FAA decision affect the procurement?
Further, as we all know, politics had a had to play in the initial tender process, will recent events have an impact?
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Probably won't as Military Specs and Civy Specs would be different.
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aesop081
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1- The mounting studs have not as yet been identified as the cause of the crash.
2- The issue with the mounting studs have been known for sometime and the manufactururer had issued recomendations for their replacement.
3- Only one of our aircraft has been built. Since the issue has been known for a while, it follows that ours will not be delivered with the same mounting studs as the incident aicraft.
2- The issue with the mounting studs have been known for sometime and the manufactururer had issued recomendations for their replacement.
3- Only one of our aircraft has been built. Since the issue has been known for a while, it follows that ours will not be delivered with the same mounting studs as the incident aicraft.
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SFB said:
Likely not.
Regarding consideration of a similar type airframe entering into CF service, one could note even more closely-related situations that did not affect ultimately the decision to procure a helicopter.
On the actual delivery ferry flight from Philadelphia to Ottawa on October 18, 1974, Canada's first Chinook, CH147001, broke up in mid-flight and crashed, killing the crew, yet the C-model Chinooks entered and remained in service for another 17 years.
G2G
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TSB releases more details of crash, investigation
The Telegram
Officials with the Transportation Safety Board confirmed today that a bolt in the main gearbox failed during flight and resulted in a sudden loss of oil pressure prior to the crash of the Sikorsky S-92 A in the Atlantic Ocean off Newfoundland March 12.
The crash killed 17 of the 18 people onboard the Cougar helicopter, which was making its way to oil platforms on the Grand Banks.
TSB officials released the finding during a news briefing today at St. John’s International Airport.
“So far we cannot find any other anomaly that would account for that loss of oil pressure. However, there is further analysis and work to be done on how and why that stud broke,” said Mike Cunningham.
It was one of many new details released today as investigators continue their search into the cause of the deadly crash.
Roughly 95 per cent of the wreckage has been recovered from the ocean floor, and the gear box has been sent to Sikorsky headquarters in Connecticut for analysis.
Officials related a detailed chain events just prior to the crash, and noted the flight data recorder indicated oil pressure in the gear box had dropped to zero. There was also a power interruption prior to the crash which caused the flight data recorder and cockpit voice recorder to shut off.
The flight crew radioed they were preparing to ditch, and radar indicates the aircraft descended at roughly 1,000 feet per minute. Impact data indicates the helicopter hit the water with an impact 20 times the force of gravity.
TSB officials also corrected earlier information that the chopper had crashed nose-first. It now appears the craft crashed “belly-down,” with the tail hitting first.
Cunningham also explained that 70 per cent of the worldwide fleet of Sikorsky S-92 A helicopters have now had these studs replaced.
He cautioned that the investigation is still in its early stages.
The Telegram
Officials with the Transportation Safety Board confirmed today that a bolt in the main gearbox failed during flight and resulted in a sudden loss of oil pressure prior to the crash of the Sikorsky S-92 A in the Atlantic Ocean off Newfoundland March 12.
The crash killed 17 of the 18 people onboard the Cougar helicopter, which was making its way to oil platforms on the Grand Banks.
TSB officials released the finding during a news briefing today at St. John’s International Airport.
“So far we cannot find any other anomaly that would account for that loss of oil pressure. However, there is further analysis and work to be done on how and why that stud broke,” said Mike Cunningham.
It was one of many new details released today as investigators continue their search into the cause of the deadly crash.
Roughly 95 per cent of the wreckage has been recovered from the ocean floor, and the gear box has been sent to Sikorsky headquarters in Connecticut for analysis.
Officials related a detailed chain events just prior to the crash, and noted the flight data recorder indicated oil pressure in the gear box had dropped to zero. There was also a power interruption prior to the crash which caused the flight data recorder and cockpit voice recorder to shut off.
The flight crew radioed they were preparing to ditch, and radar indicates the aircraft descended at roughly 1,000 feet per minute. Impact data indicates the helicopter hit the water with an impact 20 times the force of gravity.
TSB officials also corrected earlier information that the chopper had crashed nose-first. It now appears the craft crashed “belly-down,” with the tail hitting first.
Cunningham also explained that 70 per cent of the worldwide fleet of Sikorsky S-92 A helicopters have now had these studs replaced.
He cautioned that the investigation is still in its early stages.
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Good2Golf said:
Tangent: Only another 17 years? I seem to recall being pax in early 1992 (Montreal - Valcartier).
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Hmm... for some reason I'm fixated on Feb 1992, as part of a Reserve weekend exercise. Though perhaps it was Feb '91?
Then again, they say memory is the second thing to go, and I'ev already forgotten the first...
Then again, they say memory is the second thing to go, and I'ev already forgotten the first...
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As I recall, we flew down Fri night, Saturday the crew was still hung over from their party on Friday night there was a minor mechanical glitch that prevented flying, and Sunday we took of from Valcartier and made it most fo the way back to Montreal, but weather condition at St Hubert were too poor, so we turned around and went back to Val
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