C3 Howitzer Replacement

[Colin Parkinson]

The Rheinmetall MAN 8x8 has remarkably good off road mobility for its size and weight and probably is better than the 6x6.

Yea I saw them in Germany and was highly impressed with them. that being said the Volvo base vehicle has better ground clearance and likley the same/similar ground pressure as the 8x8 thanks to it's larger off road tires. However I think the MAN solution is the longterm better choice, thanks to drivetrain wear (Volvo is not designed for highway at all), more storage and also part/training commonality with the wrecker logistical version.

 

[Maxman1]

90 Seconds - damn and that was the olden days....

Boy, the way Glenn Miller played...

 

[FJAG]

Question here for those who set up gun lines:

What is an acceptable time for setting up a gun line, and putting effective rounds on bad guys?

We were pretty quick in Mortar Pl but that was ages ago.

Okay - several issues here.

Quick actions are a special procedure and relates to a battery/troop receiving a fire mission while traveling down the road. They are usually done during training and usually in competitions. It varies by gun. The fastest I ever did it was with an L5 in roughly 45 seconds from "Fire Mission" to "Shot, Over" using "tricks" we learned from the Airborne Battery - they won on speed with a round off in just over 30 seconds but on that one their FOO wasn't into accurate FFE as quickly.

Quick Actions do happen in real life, A Tp D Bty with TF 1-07 received one while moving to Maywand.

A Troop’s first live fire mission with high explosive would be a quick action…at night…at close to maximum range…with the digital equipment not operating. Troop Sergeant Major Terry Cole laid the pistol gun on by compass.

On a normal deployment there are phases - first is to have a recce party go out and secure the position and set it up technically for deployment. The guns and CP are at some point taken out of action at the old position and are called forward to an RV, They can be called forward as soon as the position is prepared or be left in action for hours before called forward depending on the situation. At the RV they are met by the recce TSM who brings them forward to the gun position to deploy. Ordinarily you can expect that from when they appear on the position, the guns will be recorded and ready for engagement in anywhere from three to, at most, ten minutes. The other timings vary depending on the distances involved, the terrain, the security situation etc.

In Afghanistan recce parties did not move forward on their own because of security. Instead they moved with the gun group. The whole troop then secured the position looking for mines and IEDs etc while the guns provided all-round defence until the position was ready for occupation. That slowed the process down a bit.

Note as well that with the M777's DGMS, (which also exists in one form or another on almost all western SPs) each gun is able to locate itself and orient itself. This gives the battery various options on how to do dispersed deployments beyond the standard troop or battery gun position.

 

[OldSolduer]

So no parallel by sight unit then?

 

[SeaKingTacco]

So no parallel by sight unit then?

Thanks for the nightmare you just gave me…

 

[FJAG]

So no parallel by sight unit then?

Thanks for the nightmare you just gave me…

That made me look at an early copy of the M777 gun drill manual and there is a section respecting passing parallel line from a DGMS gun to a gun whose DGMS has failed.

Some shit never changes.

 

[OldSolduer]

Thanks for the nightmare you just gave me…

It wasn’t easy to understand that’s for sure

 

[Cloud Cover]

Yup. I've run into that before on the M992.

There used to be a conveyor system inside the body of the M992. The vehicle would back up to the M109 and extend the conveyor into the lower back hatch of the M109. Crews found the conveyor slower than transferring ammo by hand and started removing the conveyor. More recently that has become a system-wide standard, I believe. They even modified the M992's back doors so as to provide protection to the crew while transferring ammo.

I think the bustle that's been added to the M109 turret also complicated conveyor operation.

The K10 has its conveyor come out of its front. This allows the vehicle to drive straight up behind the K9 and "plug in". It's a simpler construct from the M992 and, IMHO, a more elegant solution.

Looks like they require near perfect level ground to plug the conveyer into the K9?

 

[Furniture]

Looks like they require near perfect level ground to plug the conveyer into the K9?

Looked to me like there was a fair bit of elevation adjustment for the K10 conveyor belt.

Realistically, where on the planet would we be operating tracked armoured vehicles that we couldn't find reasonably level spaces for maintenance/rearm? The K9 wouldn't be reloaded like that on the gun line anyway, you'd fall back to a planned position for that sort of work.

 

[Cloud Cover]

Any road or parking lot would probably do.

 

[suffolkowner]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1767333629112258896

some platforms just soldier on and on

 

[Maxman1]

You can't fix what ain't broke.

 

[KevinB]

You can't fix what ain't broke.

Well you can’t defy physics either - which is kind of what the Army likes to try to do at times…

 

[Colin Parkinson]

Well you can’t defy physics either - which is kind of what the Army likes to try to do at times…

If we just throw Billions at it, we can extend the range by 750m

(Also DDG(X) wanders through chat)

 

[NavyShooter]

So does the XM-8, the SPIW, project SALVO, and so on...

 

[childs56]

Yea I saw them in Germany and was highly impressed with them. that being said the Volvo base vehicle has better ground clearance and likley the same/similar ground pressure as the 8x8 thanks to it's larger off road tires. However I think the MAN solution is the longterm better choice, thanks to drivetrain wear (Volvo is not designed for highway at all), more storage and also part/training commonality with the wrecker logistical version.

I would rather see a KW C500 series truck bought for our Military. The versatility of the truck series is pretty awesome. Those things in certain configurations are off road beasts.

 

[suffolkowner]

I would rather see a KW C500 series truck bought for our Military. The versatility of the truck series is pretty awesome. Those things in certain configurations are off road beasts.

We already have two 4 axle trucks, the Mack and the newly ordered(?) Zetros

 

[childs56]

We already have two 4 axle trucks, the Mack and the newly ordered(?) Zetros

Isn't it great, we will have two transport systems who have proprietary parts only available through the manufacturer. Yaaaaa. I just hope we have a domestic parts supplier for those non generic parts that break.

 

[Spencer100]

Isn't it great, we will have two transport systems who have proprietary parts only available through the manufacturer. Yaaaaa. I just hope we have a domestic parts supplier for those non generic parts that break.

Not to say your not right. But KW didn't even bid. They are the only one left with an assembly plant left in Canada too. (I'm not counting Hino)

We are getting the Daimler with the super bespoke supply chain through DG. Should be fine........

 

[childs56]

Not to say your not right. But KW didn't even bid. They are the only one left with an assembly plant left in Canada too. (I'm not counting Hino)

We are getting the Daimler with the super bespoke supply chain through DG. Should be fine........

I guess if we only use those trucks in Europe it won't be so bad. Should be ample ready supply of engine parts, electronics and other OEM parts.
I am not convinced we will have proper supply of parts here.
For example a fuel injectors for the MSVS engine is not readily available here. More them likely neither are the emissions equipment.
Time will tell.