Bob Rae Wants the Liberal Party to Pay Back Candidates Spending

[mjohnston39]

From the Globe and Mail

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/LAC.20061205.LIBSDEBT05/TPStory/TPNational/Politics/

Candidates could get loan relief
NDP says loophole could help erase payments to donor corporations
BILL CURRY

OTTAWA -- Liberal leadership candidates may never have to pay off hundreds of thousands in corporate loans because they may simply be written off, the NDP's ethics critic, Pat Martin, warns.

Now that the party is over, candidates are faced with debts to repay at the same time as the party itself must raise money for the next federal election.

The leadership race was the first contest by a major political party under the campaign finance rules brought in by Prime Minister Jean Chrétien.

Those changes amended the Canada Elections Act to ban corporate donations to leadership candidates and limit individual donations to $5,000. Should the Conservatives' Federal Accountability Act become law this month, that limit would drop to $1,000 beginning Jan. 1.

The rules say loans must be repaid within 18 months of the leadership vote or they will be considered donations; however, unlimited extensions can be granted by Elections Canada.

The punishment for violating the donation rules is a summary offence, which normally amounts to either a small fine or a few months in jail.

But when the small Canadian Action Party said this year that it could not pay back the $829,000 debt owed to the party founder, Paul Hellyer, which dated back to 1997, Mr. Hellyer simply wrote it off.

Mr. Martin said if such moves are permitted, it could allow corporations or wealthy individuals to break the donation limits through loans that are then written off.

"It's a massive loophole that you could drive a truck through," Mr. Martin said.

The NDP MP said it does not make sense that leadership candidates believe they will have a better chance of paying off their debts after the race, than during.

"It defies credulity frankly. I don't believe they [the lenders] expect to be paid back," he said.

With the Accountability Act currently before the Liberal-dominated Senate, Mr. Martin said the Liberals have a self interest not to pass the Tory ethics bill.

According to the most recent declarations, the candidates have the following debt levels: Bob Rae: $845,000; Stéphane Dion: $430,000; Ken Dryden: $300,000; Gerard Kennedy: $201,750; Scott Brison: $200,000; Joe Volpe: $180,000; Michael Ignatieff: $170,000 and Martha Hall Findlay: $130,000.

It is expected that the totals will be considerably higher when the final numbers are made public.

The candidates were allowed to spend a maximum of $3.4-million each, but have not yet declared their expenses.

Post-campaign debts have at times produced colourful and unusual developments.

Failed Liberal leadership candidate Donald Johnston took to playing Broadway show tunes in 1985 for $150 a ticket in Montreal. After finishing third in the Conservative leadership race, Tony Clement was helped out in 2005 with a $100,000 donation from second-place finisher Belinda Stronach.

At a meeting on Sunday between the Liberal leadership candidates, sources say the possibility was raised that the Liberal Party may help pay off the candidates' debts, but no conclusion was reached.

Candidates such as Mr. Dryden, Mr. Brison and Maurizio Bevilacqua, who dropped out midway through the campaign and owes more than $100,000, insisted yesterday they intend to pay back all the loans within 18 months.

"The question is for all of us and us as a party, how do we deal with it," Mr. Dryden said. "And I don't know what the answer is."

Mr. Brison said he has a plan in place to pay off all of his debts and has been successful on the fundraising front.

"Many of the people who already supported leadership candidates can probably expect when we get into the new electoral finance year, they will be called on again," he said.

Mr. Bevilacqua, who is well known for his organizing skills, says the money will simply be paid back by holding fundraisers.

"I mean, there's only one option you have and that's to get out there and raise the money," he said. "You have to work very hard."

Candidate debt

Candidates for the Liberal leadership race declared the following amounts of debt:

Bob Rae $845,000

Stéphane Dion $430,000

Ken Dryden $300,000

Gerard Kennedy $201,750

Scott Brison $200,000

Joe Volpe $180,000

Michael Ignatieff $170,000

Martha Hall Findlay $130,000

NOTE: Candidates have not reported spendings.

They were allowed to spend a maximum of $ 3.4-million.

SOURCE: ELECTIONS CANADA

My emphasis added...

Mike

 

[Yrys]

I didn't see any article in english about that, but Bob Rae is asking the PLC to
pay a part of the candidats campaign, as the party has make money with the
congres...

The 8 candidats have 2,5 millions in debt, Bob Rae alone has 850 000$.

http://www.radio-canada.ca/nouvelles/Politique/2006/12/06/002-rae-bob.shtml

Édith: PLC : Partie Libéral du Canada, aka Liberal Party of Canada

 

[vonGarvin]

I didn't see any article in english about that, but Bob rae is asking the PLC to
pay a part of the candidats campaign, as the party has make money with the
congres...

The 8 candidats have 2,5 millions in debt, Bob Rae alone has 850 000$.

http://www.radio-canada.ca/nouvelles/Politique/2006/12/06/002-rae-bob.shtml

Forgive my ignorace, but what is the PLC?

Thanks

 

[Petard]

Parti Libéral du Canada

Bob wants some of the money from all the fees the party collected for the convention

 

[Old Sweat]

Screw 'em. I suggest they have a baked goods sale, lile deserving causes do.

 

[3rd Horseman]

Oh Bobby, Bobby you pays your money you takes your chances. He must be used to all that union money paying the way of the NDP...not anymore sonny your in the big leagues now.

 

[a_majoor]

Who'd have thought it ... Bob Rae running out of cash ...  ;D

That didn't seem to be a problem back in "the day" while he was Primieer of Ontario, just rack up the charge card and keep going.  :rage:

Of course the taxpayers are still footing the bill for that one, and the way the current government is spending, we probably need a Global apocalypse to save us from the provincial economy imploding. I don't think Alberta can carry the entire nation on it's own (and I doubt they want to either).

 

[Sheerin]

Did the conservative party help with Harper's et al's debt?

 

[Journeyman]

KBC can be the Alberta Consulate's location once the country flies apart 

 

[RangerRay]

What a shock!  A liberal socialist wants someone else to pay his bills... :

 

[Yrys]

Just found something interesting...

In the french article, they say that John Rae lend 750 00$ of the 850 000$
that his brother Bob Rae has in debts...

http://www.cyberpresse.ca/article/20061206/CPACTUALITES/612060593/5596/CPACTUALITES

And Jonh Rae is a director of  Power Corporation....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power_Corporation_of_Canada

 

[cplcaldwell]

What a shock!  A liberal socialist wants someone else to pay his bills... :

Wait for it my friend.... wait for it... this chap ain't goin' away.. when the hoi-polloi tire of the CPC Mr Rae may well end up with some little nugget like the Federal Department of Health as his own personal fiefdom... then...  that liberal socialist will have us payin' his bills

Signed

A citizen of Upper Canada, old enough to remember.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Just found something interesting...

In the french article, they say that John Rae lend 750 00$ of the 850 000$
that his brother Bob Rae has in debts...

http://www.cyberpresse.ca/article/20061206/CPACTUALITES/612060593/5596/CPACTUALITES

And Jonh Rae is a director of  Power Corporation....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power_Corporation_of_Canada

Told ya!  The same guys that gave Paul Martin the low, interest, long term (read forgivable) loan to buy Canada Steamship Lines, and the ones that have the Cretin's son-in-law as a director at their subsidiary Bombardier.

 

[a_majoor]

This article lays it out in more general terms; the only difference between the Liberal candidates and the people being depicted here is the absolute dollar amounts:

http://captaincapitalism.blogspot.com/2006/12/of-strippers-and-poverty.html#comments

Of Strippers and Poverty

I had this scum bag parasite student in my economics class one time. He claimed he was the "poor starving college student" and had to go on "MinnCare" Minnesota's state subsidized health care.

So there I, as well as all the other working students in class, are paying for this little brat's health care.

Next day he comes in with a brand new portable DVD player and "The Family Guy" DVD set.

Another interesting anecdote is about strippers and dental work.

Friend of mine just opened up a dental practice and was amazed how many strippers she has patronizing her practice. She was even more amazed with their spending patterns in that when it comes to "basic" dental work like fillings, braces, etc., the (again) beloved State of Minnesota takes mine and your money to help these...err...um.."disadvantaged women."

But if they want non-basic or "cosmetic" dentistry done (teeth whitening, caps, etc.), which the beloved State of Minnesota does not pay for, they have more than enough cash to afford it.

It is the disparity between the "poor" status these people claim to the state in order to get other people's money and how they actually live that angers me, and no doubt some of you, to no end.

This poses an interesting case then for a different way to measure "poverty."

Officially, government statistics look at an "income based" approached to ascertain whether you are poor and can suck off the money blood of Captain Capitalism and all the other producers of society. However, this is frought with one glaring oversight in that it really isn't "income" that determines your standard of living, but your consumption.

Say you have a suburbanite trophy wife who files seperately in her taxes. She works part time at the local fru-fru shop selling fluff. She only makes say, $10,000 per year to chat and discuss gossip with the other trophy wives. By an income tested means she is "poor."

However, her husband is a VP at the regional investment bank and takes down $250,000 per year, allowing her to spend $249,999 of that money. By a consumption tested means she is rich.

Such an extreme example is not typical for your "poor" or "lower income" folk, but when you consider the bevy of government programs and subsidies that go to "poor" people it shouldn't be a surprise that with free housing, food, day care, child care, and health care, these people have the discretionary income to go and afford themselves DVD players, luxury dental services and so forth.

It may also go a long way in explaining why, when I drive through the public housing projects enroute to the radio show, that the majority of these "poor" people have nicer cars than me.

But fear not ladies and gentlemen, for at the forefront of every battle against socialism are your highly trained, highly intelligence and highly sexy Jedi Knights of the social sciences; economists. They've developed a consumption based measure of the poverty rate that considers what "poor" people consume, rather than earn.

Of course, it would be an easier battle if it seemed all of America wasn't hell-bent on becoming a socialist country in the first place (see post below). Maybe Ireland could use some Jedi Economists.