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Haitian leaders must all agree before Canada would lead a potential military intervention, Trudeau says

U.S. has suggested Canada could lead a multinational force in Haiti

Dylan Robertson · The Canadian Press · Posted: Nov 20, 2022 1:27 PM ET

A potential Canadian military intervention in Haiti can't happen unless all political parties in the troubled nation agree to it, Prime Minister Justin Trudeau said Sunday.

Speaking from Tunisia on the final day of the two-day Francophonie summit, Trudeau announced $16.5 million to help stabilize Haiti, where gangs are strangling access to fuel and critical supplies amid a worsening cholera outbreak.

About half the money is going toward humanitarian aid, and some of the rest is intended to help weed out corruption and prosecute gender-based violence.

But Haiti's government has asked for an international military intervention to combat gangs who have strangled access to fuel and critical supplies in the middle of the outbreak.

The United States wants Canada to lead any military intervention.

Trudeau said Sunday that Canada is working with CARICOM, the organization of Caribbean governments, along with "various actors in Haiti from all different political parties" to get a consensus on how the international community can help.

"It is not enough for Haiti's government to ask for it," he said. "There needs to be a consensus across political parties in Haiti before we can move forward on more significant steps."

He did not rule out eventually establishing a Canadian military mission on the ground in Haiti.

"Canada is very open to playing an important role, but we must have a Haitian consensus," Trudeau said in French.

New sanctions on prominent former officials
A Global Affairs Canada assessment team sent to Haiti to establish some understanding of what is happening and what could help has already returned and provided a report at meetings Trudeau said he attended.

He said the response is complicated because many "political elites" and "oligarchs" in Haiti have used the country's humanitarian crises "to enrich themselves on the backs of the Haitian people."

"So that is why our approach now is not about doing what one political party or the government wants," Trudeau said. "It's calling for a level of consensus and coherence from all actors in Haiti to call for solutions that we can actually get behind and lead on as an international community."

On Saturday Canada expanded its economic sanctions freezing the Canadian assets of Haitian political elites to now include former president Michel Martelly and former prime ministers Laurent Lamothe and Jean-Henry Ceant.

Foreign Affairs Minister Melanie Joly accused the trio of helping gangs undermine Haiti's current government and called on international partners to follow Canada's lead.

"Our goal is to make sure that these people that are profiting from the violence, that are part of a corrupted system, are facing accountability," she said.

Haitian Foreign Affairs Minister Jean Victor Geneus said the new sanctions put real consequences on those causing a "nightmare" in his country.

"These sanctions will have a dissuasive impact," he said in French, while seated between Trudeau and Joly.

Geneus said gangs are raping women and girls, preventing children from attending school and not letting sick people through roadblocks when they seek medical treatment. That means refugees are leaving for neighbouring islands.

"If the necessary conditions for safety are not re-established in a fast and urgent manner, a humanitarian catastrophe is possible in Haiti," he said in French.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/trudeau-haiti-intervention-sanctions-1.6658254
 

frozen99

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A good article from an expert on Haiti and its never-ending mess.
 

Humphrey Bogart

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Apparently they want a foreign strike force to confront the gangs still 😄


We should just send mercenaries. If only Haiti had something of actual economic value, someone would even foot the bill for it.
 

OldSolduer

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Apparently they want a foreign strike force to confront the gangs still 😄


We should just send mercenaries. If only Haiti had something of actual economic value, someone would even foot the bill for it.
Send nothing. We are not the world's peacekeepers or peacemakers.
 

CBH99

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we cannot give them the Canadian idea of health care, we cannot afford our system, how would they be able to afford it?
Oh, but we CAN afford the idea of Canadian healthcare.

What we can’t afford is the consistently stupid decisions made by provincial boards which essentially create burdens on the very health professionals they are intended to organize & serve.

What we can’t afford is to have healthcare professionals from one country (many of them with loads of experience) come here and have to start from scratch, or wait 8 months while we call their school to verify their graduation/employers to confirm employment.

(Something that we should be able to accomplish within a day or two)

What we can’t afford is for every whiny little sissypants come into the ER because of a runny nose, or a head cold. Got a cold? Go get some Buckley’s & stay home, it’s not an ER worthy emergency.


In Alberta when we had our health regions, the ‘CEO’s’ of some of those health regions gave themselves salaries in the millions.

(Calgary Health Region, the director had a salary of $3M a year…plus bonuses! We moved away from that system a while back, thank goodness. But I’m derailing the thread…)

________

Is there any economic potential with Haiti? Any at all?

(Assuming poverty was minimized and government institutions worked at a minimal level…any economic potential at all? Any resources or industries that could be assets?)
 

OldSolduer

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What we can’t afford is for every whiny little sissypants come into the ER because of a runny nose, or a head cold. Got a cold? Go get some Buckley’s & stay home, it’s not an ER worthy emergency.


I

Is there any economic potential with Haiti? Any at all?

(Assuming poverty was minimized and government institutions worked at a minimal level…any economic potential at all? Any resources or industries that could be assets?)
IMO the "whiny little sissypants" syndrome is a creation of modern society. A pill for every issue that has to be prescribed by a MD, and little Johnny with the cut finger or Janey with a skinned knee is an emergency and must be seen RIGHT NOW!!
 

FormerHorseGuard

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Oh, but we CAN afford the idea of Canadian healthcare.

What we can’t afford is the consistently stupid decisions made by provincial boards which essentially create burdens on the very health professionals they are intended to organize & serve.

What we can’t afford is to have healthcare professionals from one country (many of them with loads of experience) come here and have to start from scratch, or wait 8 months while we call their school to verify their graduation/employers to confirm employment.

(Something that we should be able to accomplish within a day or two)

What we can’t afford is for every whiny little sissypants come into the ER because of a runny nose, or a head cold. Got a cold? Go get some Buckley’s & stay home, it’s not an ER worthy emergency.


In Alberta when we had our health regions, the ‘CEO’s’ of some of those health regions gave themselves salaries in the millions.

(Calgary Health Region, the director had a salary of $3M a year…plus bonuses! We moved away from that system a while back, thank goodness. But I’m derailing the thread…)

________

Is there any economic potential with Haiti? Any at all?

(Assuming poverty was minimized and government institutions worked at a minimal level…any economic potential at all? Any resources or industries that could be assets?)
Each and every Canadian pays $8563.00 in 2022 towards health care, does not matter if your sick or not. You pay it.

The USA paid $12 530.00 US per person in 2020. Historical | CMS.

People in Haiti makes less than $2.50 a day, how would they ever pay for health care is beyond me.


They need serious help, economic, military, police, health care, food and education and that is just a start on the list. Canada cannot Nation build unless everyone in the world chips in. Not very likely
 

Colin Parkinson

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They need first aid attendants, Nurses and pharmacists. The First Aiders, do most of the patching. The Nurses do most of the public health outreach. pharmacists, provide and control the drugs along with some medical advice. Meanwhile you can train doctors from there, but they train outside of North America so they learn how to be doctors in a developing country.
 

Fishbone Jones

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I think we should just stay the hell out of there. Period. It's an international money laundering scheme and we haven't any money left to play with.

We have enough problems with our own systems, finances and politics. Those should be our priorities. Not someplace that will continue, no matter what international help and aid, to sink into a morass of crime of poverty. This is baked into their DNA and we'll never do enough to stop it. Leave them to their own devices, until someone comes out the winner, then we can deal with that person. Canada shouldn't be spending one red cent in Haiti.

It's idiotic to borrow money, on the world market, so trudeau can virtue signal and piss it away in another third world shithole. Maybe he's even getting some kicked back to his foundation, a la clinton. Nothing about this charlatan would surprise me. Trudeau does absolutely nothing unless he benefits personally from it.
 

daftandbarmy

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I think we should just stay the hell out of there. Period. It's an international money laundering scheme and we haven't any money left to play with.

We have enough problems with our own systems, finances and politics. Those should be our priorities. Not someplace that will continue, no matter what international help and aid, to sink into a morass of crime of poverty. This is baked into their DNA and we'll never do enough to stop it. Leave them to their own devices, until someone comes out the winner, then we can deal with that person. Canada shouldn't be spending one red cent in Haiti.

It's idiotic to borrow money, on the world market, so trudeau can virtue signal and piss it away in another third world shithole. Maybe he's even getting some kicked back to his foundation, a la clinton. Nothing about this charlatan would surprise me. Trudeau does absolutely nothing unless he benefits personally from it.


On the other hand...

...if you want to be seen as an International Peacekeeper Extraordinaire and leave a wonderful legacy in your wake that will ensure you can begin your next career with the UN, it could be seen as a heaven sent opportunity ;)
 

Fishbone Jones

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I don't think we have a hope in hell of maintaining our position as the world's boy scouts. I also don't think we have a hope in hell of ever getting a seat. The rest of the world has taken the view of trudeau as a tin pot dictator and have said as much in world forums. Only Canadians stay sheltered, deaf, dumb and blind to the shenanigans perpetuated by his globalist caucus and himself, thanks to his 'favourable' media. He's been measured internationally, politically and media wise, and found extremely wanting. Sending VanDoos back to Haiti won't solve a thing.
 

Czech_pivo

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Each and every Canadian pays $8563.00 in 2022 towards health care, does not matter if your sick or not. You pay it.

The USA paid $12 530.00 US per person in 2020. Historical | CMS.

People in Haiti makes less than $2.50 a day, how would they ever pay for health care is beyond me.


They need serious help, economic, military, police, health care, food and education and that is just a start on the list. Canada cannot Nation build unless everyone in the world chips in. Not very likely
Each and every Canadian pays $8563.00 in 2022 towards health care, does not matter if your sick or not. You pay it.

Not sure the above statement is correct - the cost for each and every CDN is 8563$ in HC spending, - that is very different from the phase 'each and every Canadian pays 8563$ towards health care'.

40% of Canadians pay nothing in income tax - the top 20% of Canadians pay over 70% of the total amount of income tax collected.

 

FormerHorseGuard

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Each and every Canadian pays $8563.00 in 2022 towards health care, does not matter if your sick or not. You pay it.

Not sure the above statement is correct - the cost for each and every CDN is 8563$ in HC spending, - that is very different from the phase 'each and every Canadian pays 8563$ towards health care'.

40% of Canadians pay nothing in income tax - the top 20% of Canadians pay over 70% of the total amount of income tax collected.

no you personally do not pay the bill, but our tax dollars do and our debt is paid based on taxes. How would a country pay for a health care system when 2 of the richest countries in North America cannot pay for it without going into debt? That was my thought, guess I needed to be more clear on it.

How would the poorest Nation in the area pay for health care?
 

Edward Campbell

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I don't think we have a hope in hell of maintaining our position as the world's boy scouts. I also don't think we have a hope in hell of ever getting a seat. The rest of the world has taken the view of trudeau as a tin pot dictator and have said as much in world forums. Only Canadians stay sheltered, deaf, dumb and blind to the shenanigans perpetuated by his globalist caucus and himself, thanks to his 'favourable' media. He's been measured internationally, politically and media wise, and found extremely wanting. Sending VanDoos back to Haiti won't solve a thing.
Even if we had three full strength battalions of VanDoos (and three more battalions of, say, Les Volitgeurs, and two fully equipped regiments of main battle tanks and a a full-up, properly equipped and trained ISTAR regiment and a full strength 4 battery regiment of artillery and a couple of fully equipped Tac Hel squadrons and say, 3,000 combat engineers and 5,000 well trained, properly equipped combat logisticians (and maintainers) that wouldn't be enough to do what probably needs doing in Haiti - a lawless country of 11 Million people.

The current "government" needs to be replaced by an imposed, 'trustee,' civil administration; the county's military needs to be disarmed and so does its huge criminal element - thousands of men will have to be killed because neither group, especially not the latter one, will go down easily. Then order needs to be maintained for years decades while institutions, including proper military and police forces are built and the economy is developed.

That's the work of generations - and it is hard, bloody and thankless work, too.
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Instead, I suggest we send Justin Trudeau, Melanie Joly, Harjit Sajjan, Ahmed Hussen and Brenda Lucki to tell them to be nice and kind to one another, turn in their guns and stop burning oil and gas.
 

daftandbarmy

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Even if we had three full strength battalions of VanDoos (and three more battalions of, say, Les Volitgeurs, and two fully equipped regiments of main battle tanks and a a full-up, properly equipped and trained ISTAR regiment and a full strength 4 battery regiment of artillery and a couple of fully equipped Tac Hel squadrons and say, 3,000 combat engineers and 5,000 well trained, properly equipped combat logisticians (and maintainers) that wouldn't be enough to do what probably needs doing in Haiti - a lawless country of 11 Million people.

The current "government" needs to be replaced by an imposed, 'trustee,' civil administration; the county's military needs to be disarmed and so does its huge criminal element - thousands of men will have to be killed because neither group, especially not the latter one, will go down easily. Then order needs to be maintained for years decades while institutions, including proper military and police forces are built and the economy is developed.

That's the work of generations - and it is hard, bloody and thankless work, too.
.
.
.
.
Instead, I suggest we send Justin Trudeau, Melanie Joly, Harjit Sajjan, Ahmed Hussen and Brenda Lucki to tell them to be nice and kind to one another, turn in their guns and stop burning oil and gas.

Just for reference, Northern Ireland only has a population of about 1.5 million people and required about 16 battalions of Infantry, plus atts and dets, for over 30 years.

Oh, I forgot...

Casualty rates? 3000+ dead, times 10 wounded, or so ;)
 

Fishbone Jones

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Each and every Canadian pays $8563.00 in 2022 towards health care, does not matter if your sick or not. You pay it.

The USA paid $12 530.00 US per person in 2020. Historical | CMS.

People in Haiti makes less than $2.50 a day, how would they ever pay for health care is beyond me.


They need serious help, economic, military, police, health care, food and education and that is just a start on the list. Canada cannot Nation build unless everyone in the world chips in. Not very likely
Canada cannot nation build until we build one of our own first.
 
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